New Bel Air

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Our paper just had an article on the new
concept Bel Air. Not as retro looking as
the Bird but a nice clean looking pkg.
It says will be based on a full size
platform. Car was shown at the Detroit
Auto show.

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I saw the bel cant compete, but the mercedes slk at alot more money can! The new european and japanese 2 seaters have more power than the bird, but thats been covered.
tleslie --- our paper did not go into much
detail. Did you see it in person. Was
wondering what they based it on.

Looked at a Mercedes 2 seater during our
local car show. Seemed smaller than the bird.
Not sure about the model #
Price was around 60K but did have some
performance pkg.
One of the guys here at work just bought a SLK and it has been back to the shop 5 times already. Once for a lousy prep job, once to replace the fuel level sensor, once to replace a sensor seal in the tranny (leaking fluid) and not sure of the other two trips. I guess it just goes to show no matter how much you pay or the reputation of the manufacturer, things can (and will) go wrong.
jodrod -- Don't know if this is sour grapes
or what but !! The salesman that ordered
my vette from works with both models. The dealerships are the same owner, Chevy faces
one street, Mercedes the other and Honda to
the side.

Anyway said Mercedes are not what they use
to be in terms of build quality. In order to
compete price wise in todays market a lot
of the hands on is gone. Said took a tour
of the Mercedes plant and the Corvette plant,
did not see that much different. Not putting
down (Mercedes owners) just repeating what
a salesman said.

Mom does like the disappearing top idea on
the little roadster. Just got an E-mail
from an Emil at EZ top in Houston. He thinks
can work something out for her pitched roof
ceiling. Would be easier than installing at
my place and driving back and forth.
Come on people, this IS A T-BIRD site. We don't need any other input from any other make. These people should go to a site dealing with their cars, not ours. I am not a closed minded person but all I want here on this site is about T-Birds. This is what this site is for and nothing else. If Gary likes his MB. Then that is OK. Just keep it off OUR SITE. I guess I am being a Prick about this but if I wanted a MB, or a Chevy I would be on one of their sites. I'm not because I bought a 02 T-Bird and that is all I want to hear about. Sorry about this but I had to VENT.

Blue on Blue Prem. STILL WAITING Ordered in Jan. 7of12 NOW 4of12
69 Vette
73 MGB
97 F-150 4x4
2-Seadoo Jet Skies
a dog a cat and a couple hundred fish in my pond
Got Vin. 109293 Build Date 01/14
GW You're Back!

You are very correct in asserting your buying power. The BMW M3Convertible is a great auto and much better quality than any Ford product.
I had my NM Bird parked next ot a Black M3 and the lines of the Bird are no contest for the M3.
The performance, safety features, and build quality of the M3 are second to none.

I enjoy my Thunderbird and hope Ford can pull out of a downward spiral both with it's products and people.

Good luck and happy motoring.

'56 + NM '02 Birds
'98F250'01 Olds Aurora4.0
'73 Volvo 1800ES
CAPTAIN, you've got to be kidding! The M3 looks like an ugly boat next to the stylish T-bird. No, offense, Gary.
Originally posted by FDCAPTAIN:
GW You're Back!

I had my NM Bird parked next ot a Black M3 and the lines of the Bird are no contest for the M3.

I'm not sure how to interpret this statement, but I would like to think it is meant that the lines or styling of the Bird WIN, with no contest. I can't honestly compare quality or handling, but I can compare what I see, and the Thunderbird body is the winner!

Dennis Grant
1960 HT 208K
1992 Sport 227K
Gents, That's exactly what I meant. The Thunderbird is breathtaking to look at. The M3 is more of a BMW muscle car and it is styled as such.

I was parked next to another Babyboomer with the same delima as GW, about $50-60K to spend on a car. He looked hard at the Bird, he also owns a Mazda Miata, but decided to go for the faster,four seat M3 Convertible.

So behind every M3Convertible owner I know, is a Bird lover!
Gary has been with us (and at BON) for longer than most of you - and has always provided intelligent and logical complaints about what he feels are the shortcomings of a car for which dealers are charging $50,000.
Some of you will remember "waiting patiently" who did the same. WP and Gary both had a Bird ordered and both cancelled for different reasons. Both liked the looks of the Bird as much as we do, and both argued passionately about what they saw as problems.

Why is it ok for most of you to complain about visor design, boot design, wheels, NM trim not available to all, hardtop fit, Thunderbird Collection delivery, etc., etc., etc., but as soon as Gary pops in with a legitimate comment about the performance of a $50,000 car everyone piles on? I'm still disappointed with the paint job, but have given up ever trying to present a complaint on this board. I own a 1999 Saturn coupe (3 door), a 2000 Chrysler Cyrrus, a 2001 Jag S-Type, and a 2002 Jetta - two of which are black like my Bird, all but the Jag cheaper than the Bird (3 of them half the price of the Bird) and none of them have any orangepeel. Ford says its part of the paint process - every car on the lot has it. BUT they don't sell every car on the lot for $50K. Gary's point is that if you want to sell a $50k car, make it worth $50k - that means styling, fit, finish, visors and performance. Like most of you, I have decided that the styling is so great the deficiencies don't bother me enough to buy something else - but that really means we've chosen style over performance. Gary is suggesting that if Ford wanted to, they could have provided both the style and better performance for this price. so listen to what he has to say or don't read his posts, but stop the stupid piling on.

As far as I'm concerned, Gary, you are welcome anytime.

neiman vin#00035
delivered October 4, 2001
jodrod - not talking about you but my
salesman and his Mercedes comment.

Gary - what is the SMG. I had a BMW 5
series and thought M pkg was the performance

That's why would like an off topic so
we can discuss things other than the
bird a little. The site is going to
die if don't bring some other topic
now and than.
Simply put, I don't agree.

Blue on Blue Prem. STILL WAITING Ordered in Jan. 7of12 NOW 4of12
69 Vette
73 MGB
97 F-150 4x4
2-Seadoo Jet Skies
a dog a cat and a couple hundred fish in my pond
Got Vin. 109293 Build Date 01/14
Gobird - only time will tell, who knows.

It seems if someone new comes on board
and doesn't think the T-Bird is the
second coming, they are quick to be
run off. Some do just stir the pot but
others do have good points.

Sort of in-line with what Gary says --
Ford could have at least put all the
options currently on the LS8 on the
new Bird.
Lest my meaning by misconstrued - I meant the 'ugly boat' remark as a rib. Kind of a welcome back to one of our better sparring partners. I never understood the animosity some have expressed toward Gary.

Speaking of expensive German cars with flawless engineering, there was a story in the local paper today about a man who was trapped in his late model Audi when it caught fire and a safety restraining system failed. The fire department rescued him in time, but he was badly injured. Now does that call into question the reputation of all Audis for being 'firetraps'? Of course not, but imagine what the reaction from critics would have been had the car been a Thunderbird - they'd be labeling it a pricy Pinto or worse and predicting Ford's imminent demise. Which I guess some are gonna do anyway.

Apple vs. Orange (with or without peel)
I think it should be pointed out that comparing a $40,000 Thunderbird to GW's $60,000 BMW is an apple vs. orange comparison. Sure, some dealers are setting their price at $50,000 but Ford is manufacturing a $40,000 car. There are cars comparable to the BMW but that discussion, indeed, belongs on another site.

I have read many of the previous discussions involving GW and I agree that he can provide interesting and thought-provoking comments. However, often they are based on a flawed premise (such as the current discussion). All I am trying to say is that we don't need to defend the Thunderbird when it is compared to GW's BMW anymore than GW would need to defend his BMW if it were compared to one of the exotics.
STOP IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. This is about T-Birds, NOT BMW's, Benz's or any other damned car on the road. darn, it was so peaceful here for so long!
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