2003 won’t start after repairs

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Thunderbirdy

Thunderbirdy

Member
Gold Member
Last seen
Joined
Oct 14, 2021
Thunderbird Year
2003
Hi all. I have a one of 9 whisper white 03 thunderbird, 05/03 build.

Car came to me with 120k miles, a pcm vin mismatch and an egr map sensor issue.

Changed all of the fluids except transmission in the car.
Replaced battery
Replaced pcv line as it was broken
Replaced fuel pressure sensor as the nipple was broken.
Replaced maf as I was in there
Replaced all coils (5-8 had oil and corrosion on the boots)
Replaced all plugs in all cylinders.
Cleaned all connectors with Cbc electric contact cleaner
Replaced all of the relays
Tested all of the fuses except front passenger ones.

Car won’t start.

One other Item to note is that based on some recommendations I used the stp pro series intake valve cleaner (19127 is the part number). Followed procedure. Ran the car and she was flying. All was well when we started to go up a bridge. Felt a slam. She stopped having any acceleration. Got her towed to dealer and 4 days later they said egr valve first to start the journey.

I’m stumped and can’t figure out why she won’t run.

Ruled our FEM as the other fem controlled parts work as expected.
Ruled out pcm as it was just flashed and vin was corrected to ensure no mismatch.

When I crank her, she tries to turn over just doesn’t make it. There is a rich smell of fuel and chemical from the exhaust after as well.

Any help would be appreciated.

Also I’m aware, never use stp crap in a car again.
 
Thunderbirdy said:
Hi all. I have a one of 9 whisper white 03 thunderbird, 05/03 build.

Car came to me with 120k miles, a pcm vin mismatch and an egr map sensor issue.

Changed all of the fluids except transmission in the car.
Replaced battery
Replaced pcv line as it was broken
Replaced fuel pressure sensor as the nipple was broken.
Replaced maf as I was in there
Replaced all coils (5-8 had oil and corrosion on the boots)
Replaced all plugs in all cylinders.
Cleaned all connectors with Cbc electric contact cleaner
Replaced all of the relays
Tested all of the fuses except front passenger ones.

Car won’t start.

One other Item to note is that based on some recommendations I used the stp pro series intake valve cleaner (19127 is the part number). Followed procedure. Ran the car and she was flying. All was well when we started to go up a bridge. Felt a slam. She stopped having any acceleration. Got her towed to dealer and 4 days later they said egr valve first to start the journey.

I’m stumped and can’t figure out why she won’t run.

Ruled our FEM as the other fem controlled parts work as expected.
Ruled out pcm as it was just flashed and vin was corrected to ensure no mismatch.

When I crank her, she tries to turn over just doesn’t make it. There is a rich smell of fuel and chemical from the exhaust after as well.

Any help would be appreciated.

Also I’m aware, never use stp crap in a car again.
Click to expand...
Converters are plugged up, disconnect them at the manifolds and try starting
 
MMM....gotta say, that engine bogging after a "slam" doesn't bode well and the "cranking but not turning" symptoms aren't good either.
You may have more going on than electroncs or fuel. I think you'll need a good tech to check out the mechanicals.
You MAY luck out and had a backfire and possible cam sensor issue but that'll have to be diagnosed.
 
Thunderbirdy said:
Thanks. The fuel pumps were replaced in February.
Click to expand...
A reminder, just because a part is replaced does not mean the replacement part works, especially if it came from aftermarket China. I once replaced an alternator on a car that had to be replaced. The replacement worked for years.

With that said, you aren't likely going to find a solution online. You need go find a good mechanic with experience working on the Lincoln LS and/or Thunderbird.

All I can tell you is no start issues are historically fuel pump or pressure related. Spend some time reading old posts as suggested above. There is a plethora of information.
 
Thunderbirdy said:
Hi all. I have a one of 9 whisper white 03 thunderbird, 05/03 build.

Car came to me with 120k miles, a pcm vin mismatch and an egr map sensor issue.

Changed all of the fluids except transmission in the car.
Replaced battery
Replaced pcv line as it was broken
Replaced fuel pressure sensor as the nipple was broken.
Replaced maf as I was in there
Replaced all coils (5-8 had oil and corrosion on the boots)
Replaced all plugs in all cylinders.
Cleaned all connectors with Cbc electric contact cleaner
Replaced all of the relays
Tested all of the fuses except front passenger ones.

Car won’t start.

One other Item to note is that based on some recommendations I used the stp pro series intake valve cleaner (19127 is the part number). Followed procedure. Ran the car and she was flying. All was well when we started to go up a bridge. Felt a slam. She stopped having any acceleration. Got her towed to dealer and 4 days later they said egr valve first to start the journey.

I’m stumped and can’t figure out why she won’t run.

Ruled our FEM as the other fem controlled parts work as expected.
Ruled out pcm as it was just flashed and vin was corrected to ensure no mismatch.

When I crank her, she tries to turn over just doesn’t make it. There is a rich smell of fuel and chemical from the exhaust after as well.

Any help would be appreciated.

Also I’m aware, never use stp crap in a car again.
Click to expand...
You provided a possible clue: "There is a rich smell of fuel and chemical from the exhaust after as well."

Start with that, and see if you can isolate the cause. It almost seems that the cylinders are not getting a good air/fuel mix. I once had a car that had this problem. The method I used to to isolate the problem was spraying the air filter with starter fluid, but only a little at first. The engine then seemed to sputter a little but still wouldn't start. So I repeated the procedure but used a little more starter fluid. Then it did start for a few seconds before dying. So THAT eliminated the spark plugs as the problem and told me the cylinders were not getting fuel or the proper air/fuel mixture. If you try that, be extremely careful with starter fluid as it is more volatile and dangerous than gasoline!
 
So most of my parts (coils, plugs, filters and sensors) were new motorcraft parts from online. Some of the parts came off of an 05’ Lincoln Ls v8 and some parts from an 04 thunderbird.

I had a mechanic come by today who looked at the network and computers and there are no codes and no pending codes.

Fuel pumps high and low were replaced at a ford dealer in February.

New shell 93 with a can of sea foam for good measure is in the car now.

All signs point to clogged cats. Am going to pull the o2 sensor and see if she turns over.

The fuel rail seems to have good pressure and the motor has passed a pressure test.

Question for all. On the egr valve there are two vacuum lines one black and one red. Can you tell me if red is on top or black on top?
 
Thunderbirdy said:
So most of my parts (coils, plugs, filters and sensors) were new motorcraft parts from online. Some of the parts came off of an 05’ Lincoln Ls v8 and some parts from an 04 thunderbird.

I had a mechanic come by today who looked at the network and computers and there are no codes and no pending codes.

Fuel pumps high and low were replaced at a ford dealer in February.

New shell 93 with a can of sea foam for good measure is in the car now.

All signs point to clogged cats. Am going to pull the o2 sensor and see if she turns over.

The fuel rail seems to have good pressure and the motor has passed a pressure test.

Question for all. On the egr valve there are two vacuum lines one black and one red. Can you tell me if red is on top or black on top?
Click to expand...
Clogged cats should not necessarily prevent initial ignition in the cylinders, even if momentarily before dying. That is especially true if no codes have been thrown. Since you have no codes, I am questioning why an O2 sensor would be pulled....?
 
Black T said:
Clogged cats should not necessarily prevent initial ignition in the cylinders, even if momentarily before dying. That is especially true if no codes have been thrown. Since you have no codes, I am questioning why an O2 sensor would be pulled....?
Click to expand...
Since the last replies here are the things I’ve done

1) pulled the o2 sensor - she started right up and drove for 25 miles with varied speeds of 0-80 mph. No trans issues. No other problems.

2) put the o2 sensor back in, starts no problems, when I press the accelerator there’s nothing there. Leads me to believe there’s a vacuum leak somewhere.

3) added some coolant as I had lost some due to trying to burp the system.

4) removed the battery and plugged it in again for a full reset.

HVAC self test was done, no codes

Obd2 reader in, no codes

Reverse out of driveway no issue. Press the pedal, no acceleration over 1000rpm.

Car is showing it has no gas which I don’t believe is true but I’m adding in 5 gallons of 93 just in case.

Am also replacing a vacuum hose just in case.
 
Thunderbirdy said:
Fuel pumps high and low were replaced at a ford dealer in February.
Click to expand...
I'm not aware of any OEM fuel pumps that are available, so what did the dealership use for parts during this February repair?

Thunderbirdy said:
Car is showing it has no gas which I don’t believe is true but I’m adding in 5 gallons of 93 just in case.
Click to expand...
Which would be an indication of a problem/failure with the fuel pump and/or sending unit. As I mentioned above, over the years, most of the no start issues are related to the fuel pump(s).
 
AE2CBB30-82A1-446E-A39C-E94DABF3F960.jpegI took the o2 sensor out and was able to start the car, and drove it down to the muffler shop. In their scan it shows back pressure on the meter while revving in park. It’s the cats. The fuel is getting there. I have no idea what parts they used for the pump repair, all I have is the invoice showing high and low fuel pump replaced and warrantied for one year.
 
biddle said:
I'm not aware of any OEM fuel pumps that are available, so what did the dealership use for parts during this February repair?


Which would be an indication of a problem/failure with the fuel pump and/or sending unit. As I mentioned above, over the years, most of the no start issues are related to the fuel pump(s).
Click to expand...
One note, when the fuel pressure sensor was replaced, the fuel gage came back and showed all of the fuel in the car. Seems the pressure loss was because it wasn’t seated correctly and the gauge is triggered to show no fuel. That problem is now solved.
 
Wow, what a story of issues. Hope it all turns out well.
 
Issyro said:
Wow, what a story of issues. Hope it all turns out well.
Click to expand...
I should have introduced the car. It’s a 1 of 9 whisper white 03’s. She lived a full life of 110k miles till 2015 in south beach Florida. At that time she was sold the second owner bought her with issues and put all of 7000 miles on her. The mechanic told the owner that’s how it was supposed to be because they couldn’t fix it. It started with the pcm being replaced in 2015 and the vin not being set correctly for the car. This did its own damage and the car has simply sat in the garage and the rain on and off.

The second owner drove 7k miles in 7 years.

The second owner had new fuel pumps, tires, and brakes installed all around including new calipers as the brakes had failed. The second owner purchased a used hardtop and had it painted to the body color. The body was also clear coat restored and ceramic shielded.

The car still jerked into gear and sounded terrible according to the owner and was listed for sale as is.

Since then I’ve purchased the car and have started working on repairing her. I’ve taken apart the valve covers, cleaned, and painted them and added new gaskets and reinstalled with new coils, plugs, and pigtails. I’ve also seen some other error codes and started work there. I’ve replaced the MAF, the TPS, the EGR valve and solenoid, the fuel rail pressure sensor, pigtails, cabin and oil filter, fuel filter, and I’ve also replaced 4 out of 5 fluids. Left trans as is until need for repair. I’ve also resolved the lamp out issue by replacing all of the bulbs. I have one front bumper mounted light that is not working after new bulbs and I’m waiting for a new pigtail to get that resolved.

Now came some back pressure based on the reading from the muffler shop. They wanted a lot of money for generic catalytic converters. I was able to order the Magnaflow high flow oem fit cats for the car and the borla cat back exhaust for the car. Those parts won’t arrive till end of November due to manufacturing delays.

The fruit will be worth the spoils as they say, or so I hope
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Thunderbirdy said:
I took the o2 sensor out and was able to start the car, and drove it down to the muffler shop. In their scan it shows back pressure on the meter while revving in park. It’s the cats. The fuel is getting there. I have no idea what parts they used for the pump repair, all I have is the invoice showing high and low fuel pump replaced and warrantied for one year.
Click to expand...
Since you removed the o2 sensor and the engine started up and you were able to drive the car for 25 miles with varied speeds of 0-80 mph and after you put the o2 sensor back in when you pressed on the accelerator there’s nothing there, that should tell you that the converters are blocked as @Mrdan said. Before you go any further, replace the converters.

doug7740
1955 Thunderbird Blue
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Thunderbirdy said:
Hi all. I have a one of 9 whisper white 03 thunderbird, 05/03 build.

Car came to me with 120k miles, a pcm vin mismatch and an egr map sensor issue.

Changed all of the fluids except transmission in the car.
Replaced battery
Replaced pcv line as it was broken
Replaced fuel pressure sensor as the nipple was broken.
Replaced maf as I was in there
Replaced all coils (5-8 had oil and corrosion on the boots)
Replaced all plugs in all cylinders.
Cleaned all connectors with Cbc electric contact cleaner
Replaced all of the relays
Tested all of the fuses except front passenger ones.

Car won’t start.

One other Item to note is that based on some recommendations I used the stp pro series intake valve cleaner (19127 is the part number). Followed procedure. Ran the car and she was flying. All was well when we started to go up a bridge. Felt a slam. She stopped having any acceleration. Got her towed to dealer and 4 days later they said egr valve first to start the journey.

I’m stumped and can’t figure out why she won’t run.

Ruled our FEM as the other fem controlled parts work as expected.
Ruled out pcm as it was just flashed and vin was corrected to ensure no mismatch.

When I crank her, she tries to turn over just doesn’t make it. There is a rich smell of fuel and chemical from the exhaust after as well.

Any help would be appreciated.

Also I’m aware, never use stp crap in a car again.
Click to expand...
What ending up being the culprit of your no start issue?
 
Just as a point of knowledge in the world of car diagnostics ”turn over” equals “crank”. Turn over meaning starter motor spins the engine .so turn over does not mean start.crank means starter motor spins the engine.if you had a weak battery you might describe it as it turns over or cranks slowly.
 
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